Frag Infinity Tournament, Inc. - FITES LAN Party - www.fites.net
LAN Party Forums => General Discussion => Started by: vincegun on May 05, 2009, 11:28:25 AM
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download here:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/download.aspx (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/download.aspx)
XP mode (beta) is officially live here:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=0e8fa9b3-c236-4b77-be26-173f032f5159 (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=0e8fa9b3-c236-4b77-be26-173f032f5159)
XP mode needs a processor "capable of hardware virtualization, with AMD-V™ or Intel® VT turned on in the BIOS." I wasn't sure what AMD chips supported this, so I did some quick googling. As per wiki.xensource.com, "The desktop processors must be for the "socket AM2" (or above) with support for DDR2 memory and K8 Rev. F2 stepping and above (F3,G1,G2,Tri- and Quadcores) that are not Sempron brand. Server processors supporting SVM include all Opterons for Socket F (aka Socket L1) with 4 digit product numbers (Opteron 1210, 2210, 8210, ...), again here with support for DDR2 memory."
Examples of supported processors are:
* all AMD Athlon™ 64 processors above 4000+
* all AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 processors above 4800+ :10: (6400+ yay for me!)
* all AMD Athlon™ X2 processors
* all AMD Athlon™ X2 BE, LE, EE processors
* all AMD Phenom™ X3 and X4 processors
Notebook processors that are branded Turion 64 X2 and Turion Ultra
* Turion™ 64 X2 TL-60
* Turion™ 64 X2 TL-56
* Turion™ 64 X2 TL-52
* Turion™ 64 X2 TL-50
* Turion™ Ultra ZM-80, ZM-82, ZM-86
AMD Opteron™ with DDR2
* 1000 Series
* 2000 Series
* 8000 Series
So for what it's worth..... yeah. Have fun with that one, I know I will.
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Oh, additional note. Starting march 1st, the win7 RC will shut down every two hours. Of course, Acer leaked that 7 will be out Oct. 23rd, so I dunno how that will or will not affect you.
Bah, useless trivia, but I figured I should throw that one in there.
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Information for Intel CPU support at http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=946 (http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=946)
Handy Reference Table
Desktop CPUS
Core 2 Duo
E4300/4400/4500/4600/4700 NO
E6300/6320/6400/6420/6540/6550 YES
E6600/6700/6750/6850 YES
E7200/7300/7400/7500 NO
E8190 NO
E8200/8300/8400/8500/8600 YES
Core 2 Extreme
QX6700/6800/6850 YES
QX9650/9770/9775 YES
X6800 YES
Core 2 Quad
Q6600/6700 YES
Q8200/8200S/8300/8400/8400S NO
Q9300/9400/9400S YES
Q9450/9550/9550S/9650 YES
Core i7/Core i7 Extreme
I7-920/940 YES
I7-965 YES
Pentium D/Pentium EE
805/820/830/840 NO
915/925/935/945 NO
920/930/940/950/960 YES
955/965 YES
Pentium for Desktop
E2140/2160/2180/2200/2220 NO
E5200/5300/5400 NO
Mobile CPU products
Core 2 Duo Mobile
L7200/7300/7400/7500 YES
P7350/7450 NO
P7370 YES
P8400/8600/8700/9500/9600 YES
SL9300/9400/9600 YES
SP9300/9400/9600 YES
SU9300/9400/9600 YES
T5200/5250/5270/5300/5450/5470 NO
T5500/5600 YES
T5550/5670/5750/5800/5850/5870/5900 NO
T6400/6570 NO
T7100/7200/7250/7300/7400 YES
T7500/7600/7700/7800 YES
T8100/8300 YES
T9300/9400/9500/9550/9600/9800 YES
U7500/U7600 YES
Core 2 Extreme Mobile
QX9300 YES
X7800/7900 YES
X9000/9100 YES
Core 2 Quad Mobile
Q9000 YES
Q9100 NO
Core 2 Solo
SU3300/3500 YES
U2100/2200 YES
Core Duo
L2300/2400/2500 YES
T2050/2250 NO
T2300/2400/2500/2600/2700 YES
T2300E/2350/2450 NO
U2400/2500 YES
Core Solo
T1300/1400 YES
T1350 NO
U1300/1400/1500 YES
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Intel Fail?
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This would mean the bios would have to support it as well, right? If there's no option, there's no support.... right? I don't recall seeing any option to turn anything on or off, meaning it's always on or it just isn't there.
Am I overthinking this?
Game over man, GAME OVER!!!!! :confused:
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At least partially, it seems. My test machine at work has the right CPU, so I'll be trying this out very shortly.
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From TFA:
The new Windows Virtual PC (now available as a beta release for the Windows 7 Release Candidate) requires hardware-assisted virtualization. For your PC to run XP Mode in Windows 7, the CPU has to support Intel Virtualization Technology (Intel VT) or AMD Virtualization (AMD-V), and this support has to be enabled in the BIOS.
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d'oh
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E8600 woot.
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Okay, got a question for you bios-centric folks. It seems (and I will have to check once I finish downloading the public RC) that my current board, the one I'm posting and gaming on right now, does not support hardware virtualization. The currently available manual on the Asus site says so, anyway. However, the currently available manual for my MSI board says it supports "secure virtual machine (for am2+ cpu only)."
Is this the bios setting I'm looking for? Pardon my slight ignorance, but I've not dealt with this kind of thing before. I'mma need a solid base of knowledge to work with before I have reason to switch all my parts over to the other (potentially better) board.
and even if I do have to switch the parts over.... I still have to move my data to my ex470 server, and I don't have a 1.5tera drive to move it on all onto. d'oh again.
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Well I thought I'd be trying this out. I got everything installed and went to run VXP and got greeted with the nice little message that tells me hardware virtualization is not enabled in my BIOS. There are several options in my BIOS to enable/disable hardware virtualization support and all of them are turned on, so I don't know what else it wants. This is on a Dell Optiplex 755. I checked for a BIOS update that would add additional support, but I'm only one version off the current revision and there's nothing in the new version about virtualization support. So I guess I won't get to try this out afterall.
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I checked my current board's bios and I found an option for "AMD Virtualization." Seems like I might be in business. I'm off!
:nerd2:
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As for the new taskbar, I found a couple things out during the beta regarding this new-fangled taskbar. First off, I'm pretty sure those who have used Beta already know about the new quicklaunch and taskbar pinning. Some of you may have noticed that when clicking a quicklaunch icon, it uses that icon to expand itself onto the taskbar. You may have thought to yourself, "Well that's stupid, now I can't use that icon to open a new instance!". Bzzzt! Wrong! Middle-clicking a task creates a new instance, as does shift-left clicking.
I never used quicklaunch in any of the previous Windows OS's. But this is definitely awesome, along with the ability to drag tasks along the taskbar.... which is a feature that SHOULD have been there since Windows 95.
Other hotkeys: http://brandonlive.com/2009/01/10/windows-7-beta-hotkey-cheat-sheet/ (http://brandonlive.com/2009/01/10/windows-7-beta-hotkey-cheat-sheet/)
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Note #1 - Was able to get 8800gtx in 5040x1050 with 180 series drivers and a beta version of the triplehead2go software made for win7. Was NOT able to do this in vista and the 180 series. I lost aero effect, for whatever reason. Doesn't matter, I got 5040 with a semi-current driver set!
Win7 - 1
Vista - 0
Note #2 - http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5639/xpmodesetup.jpg (http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5639/xpmodesetup.jpg) (warning: 5040rez)
Note #3 - http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6392/xpmoderunning.jpg (http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6392/xpmoderunning.jpg) (5040rez again)
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Oh snap, you can update the beta WinXP SP3 through windows update. HA!
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Plus, windows virtual machine install of Win98SE going smoothly.
There ain't no skool like the oldskool!
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Moar cool info!
"Those who use Remote Desktop Connection to take control of other computers on their networks will have something to be pleased about -- when you pin the Remote Desktop Connection to your task bar, it now includes in the Jump List all of the remote desktop connections you've saved. So you can now more easily take control of a remote PC."
w00t!
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I noticed this by accident and got excited cause I use RDP a TON!
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Note #1 - Was able to get 8800gtx in 5040x1050 with 180 series drivers and a beta version of the triplehead2go software made for win7. Was NOT able to do this in vista and the 180 series. I lost aero effect, for whatever reason. Doesn't matter, I got 5040 with a semi-current driver set!
Win7 - 1
Vista - 0
Note #2 - [url]http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5639/xpmodesetup.jpg[/url] ([url]http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5639/xpmodesetup.jpg[/url]) (warning: 5040rez)
Note #3 - [url]http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6392/xpmoderunning.jpg[/url] ([url]http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6392/xpmoderunning.jpg[/url]) (5040rez again)
Holy crap dude, those screenshots are HUGE!
Here's a tip, a feature that was introduced in Vista is called the Snipping tool and is still there in 7 too. You can "Snip" just a portion of the screen. Or, a feature that's been around since at least Win95(!) is Alt-PrintScreen to only capture the active window instead of the whole tri-monitor screen. FFS!
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Another way to tell if your proc supports hardware virtualization is by running the "Securable" app from GRC at http://www.grc.com/securable.htm. (http://www.grc.com/securable.htm.) This won't tell you anything about your BIOS supporting it, but at least give you a nod if your CPU will support it.
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But bigger is always better!
Or overkill is always better....
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Not when the download of the image fails ;) (though it does seem to be downloading OK today)
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From the looks of things, it seems that W7 does background defragging. I haven't defragged in almost 2 months, and my main data drive is only 0.24% fragmented (5 files). Very cool.
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Nevermind, W7 just schedules the defragger by default. Oh well.
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Hey - sorry ive been out of pocket lately, we are working on an R2 release for Server 2008, and ive been working with our larger corporate customers getting med-v, and hyper-v components mainstreamed for them.
So how do you folks like Win7 So far? Please remember that this is a release candidate, and the enhanced XP Compatibility Mode feature, is designed around our corporate customer base, and support is "very" limited. The premise around it using the Intel Virtualization-T, is that it allows the virtualization technology (a loose hypervisor) to make direct calls to the CPU/Memory/HW Layer, ruling out processing through the operating system.
I would probably be shot for saying this outside of here, but if you are looking for more of an enhanced compatibility experience, I use VMware Workstation at home, with the Unity Portion of 6.5.1. which gives you the seamless application window, and does not require intel virtualization technology on your processor. The only Caveat is you lose a little bit of performance to processing functions through the VMHostKernel Process and vmxnet, also you obviously will need more memory to support the virtual machines operations.
As far as the defrag piece goes.. We build alot of lazy functionality into it... I recommend that you turn off te automatic defrag piece, as you will get some undesired results (aka defrag kicking off when you are in the middle of a game, etc) also if you are comfortable with your troubleshooting skills, turn off System Restore.
All in all we are shooting to make this a really good OS release, and I appreciate your feedback.
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http://www.vwrsp.com/ (http://www.vwrsp.com/) doesn't looks like msft.
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Well, I currently love this OS. I think the only problems I have so far is the fact that every video player I use that isn't Windows Media Player pixelates the video. I at first thought it was the nvidia drivers when I had my old card in, then when I got my ATI card, it has been doing the same thing. It still could very well be the graphic drivers, of course. Just a little annoying.
The only other bogusness I've been experiencing is when working with any of my CS4 products. It's a rare, but highly irritating bug. Has happened with After Effects, Photoshop, and Illustrator so far. With either program, I am constantly saving and re-saving particular files. Again, it's very rare, but there are times when I go to save over, or render over, a file that I have been saving over a few times already and it all of a sudden tells me access denied. When you go and try to delete the file, it gives the same error. I was able to find out that what happens is the file is deleted from the hard drive, but the file stays in windows explorer until you restart the system. It's as if CS4 deletes it (when it shouldn't), but doesn't tell Windows that it's gone. Anyways, no real harm is caused, it's just supremely inconvenient when it does happen.
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And I have constant USB issues with my iPhone.
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[url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url] ([url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url]) doesn't looks like msft.
that would be the customer im at, and its actually vwr.com
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Well, I currently love this OS. I think the only problems I have so far is the fact that every video player I use that isn't Windows Media Player pixelates the video. I at first thought it was the nvidia drivers when I had my old card in, then when I got my ATI card, it has been doing the same thing. It still could very well be the graphic drivers, of course. Just a little annoying.
The only other bogusness I've been experiencing is when working with any of my CS4 products. It's a rare, but highly irritating bug. Has happened with After Effects, Photoshop, and Illustrator so far. With either program, I am constantly saving and re-saving particular files. Again, it's very rare, but there are times when I go to save over, or render over, a file that I have been saving over a few times already and it all of a sudden tells me access denied. When you go and try to delete the file, it gives the same error. I was able to find out that what happens is the file is deleted from the hard drive, but the file stays in windows explorer until you restart the system. It's as if CS4 deletes it (when it shouldn't), but doesn't tell Windows that it's gone. Anyways, no real harm is caused, it's just supremely inconvenient when it does happen.
re: - graphics issues? are you running the aero interface with overlays?
re: - cs4 - are you saving the files on the same drive as your scratch disks?
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[url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url] ([url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url]) doesn't looks like msft.
that would be the customer im at, and its actually vwr.com
And you only post from there?
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And I have constant USB issues with my iPhone.
That has been a commonly reported issue, Do you have an updated version of itunes installed, or are you using the ml_ipod plugin?
Theres nothing really out there on ms connect for it, other than a bunch of questions, and some concerns with running the iphone sdk.
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[url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url] ([url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url]) doesn't looks like msft.
that would be the customer im at, and its actually vwr.com
And you only post from there?
Not sure where this is going, but typically when I get in a particular area, working at a customer location, I look for a lanparty to go to. I post looking to see whats up.
So if you're trying to infer that I dont work for MSFT, by all means assume away, arguing on the internet is like competiting in the special olympics. all I was doing was asking a question, I guess ill go back to work now!
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Latest iTunes... And there is no iPhone SDK for Windows...
Windows just after about a day of being up, unrecognized device and then it's all USB 2.0 ports that I then plug ANY device into.
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[url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url] ([url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url]) doesn't looks like msft.
that would be the customer im at, and its actually vwr.com
And you only post from there?
Not sure where this is going, but typically when I get in a particular area, working at a customer location, I look for a lanparty to go to. I post looking to see whats up.
So if you're trying to infer that I dont work for MSFT, by all means assume away, arguing on the internet is like competiting in the special olympics. all I was doing was asking a question, I guess ill go back to work now!
Not arguing... I am just saying I/we see no proof of your credentials. You have 19 posts at this time... And you post as if you had the authority of doing so for msft, but only post from one IP address that is not them. I just won't trust someones word on the internet.
Sorry I flipped your skirt.
EDIT: And I mean same IP from 2007.
Hey Folks - Wanted to stop by and say hello. I am relatively new to the area, transferred up here for my job.
And the conflicting posts...
I am just skeptical.
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Latest iTunes... And there is no iPhone SDK for Windows...
Windows just after about a day of being up, unrecognized device and then it's all USB 2.0 ports that I then plug ANY device into.
Running UAC? x86 or x64?
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[url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url] ([url]http://www.vwrsp.com/[/url]) doesn't looks like msft.
that would be the customer im at, and its actually vwr.com
And you only post from there?
Not sure where this is going, but typically when I get in a particular area, working at a customer location, I look for a lanparty to go to. I post looking to see whats up.
So if you're trying to infer that I dont work for MSFT, by all means assume away, arguing on the internet is like competiting in the special olympics. all I was doing was asking a question, I guess ill go back to work now!
Not arguing... I am just saying I/we see no proof of your credentials. You have 19 posts at this time... And you post as if you had the authority of doing so for msft, but only post from one IP address that is not them. I just won't trust someones word on the internet.
Sorry I flipped your skirt.
not flipping my skirt , touche for not trusting everything you see on the internet! as far as credentials, I guess one of these days ill be in town during one of your lans, we can talk then. Otherwise im just another gamer, with a particular interest in feedback on microsoft products specifically reproduceable items on the Server series products!
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Latest iTunes... And there is no iPhone SDK for Windows...
Windows just after about a day of being up, unrecognized device and then it's all USB 2.0 ports that I then plug ANY device into.
Running UAC? x86 or x64?
UAC off... x64.
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not flipping my skirt , touche for not trusting everything you see on the internet! as far as credentials, I guess one of these days ill be in town during one of your lans, we can talk then. Otherwise im just another gamer, with a particular interest in feedback on microsoft products specifically reproduceable items on the Server series products!
Fair enough. Can't wait till you can come and game. Try to leave work at work. ;)
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On a entirely different note: Mark I like your new avatar.
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Thanks! Agent made it!
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/flex
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I don;t feel special since agent doesn't make ME any avatars....maybe a nice 3d rotating decepticon symbol?
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not flipping my skirt , touche for not trusting everything you see on the internet! as far as credentials, I guess one of these days ill be in town during one of your lans, we can talk then. Otherwise im just another gamer, with a particular interest in feedback on microsoft products specifically reproduceable items on the Server series products!
Fair enough. Can't wait till you can come and game. Try to leave work at work. ;)
So when is the next monthly lan?
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I don;t feel special since agent doesn't make ME any avatars....maybe a nice 3d rotating decepticon symbol?
Only after i get a spinning hammer and sickle! ...with poo!
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You guys never asked me to make you one before. I probably would have.
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Oo Oo! Can I put my request in for some kinda kewl Hammer and Sickle logo??
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Aye, Comrade. Won't get to it till tomorrow though. trying something out today.
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You guys never asked me to make you one before. I probably would have.
I would be honored if you made one for me!
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Muahahahaaa... My plan on taking over the world via avatars has begun!
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Muahahahaaa... My plan on taking over the world via avatars has begun!
Makes your Parents proud right?
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You betcha.
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:rofl:
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So how do you folks like Win7 So far? Please remember that this is a release candidate
Well, I run a pretty custom and... almost unique main pc/gaming setup. This'll boil down to my specific hardware combination, but MS does have something to do with it so I figure I might as well say something.
I run a 8800gtx to a Matrox Triplehead2Go and 3 22" lcd's all running at 1680x1050 in Vista64. My maximum desktop resolution is the TH2G's max rez of 5040x1050. As it stands (and this is totally a communication problem between Matrox and Nvidia), I have to use an older driver set (170's) to get my maximum resolution. If I try to upgrade to a more modern driver release, I can't get that resolution in desktop or gaming mode. It seems upgrading drivers can and/or will break any custom resolutions made in the Nvidia control panel. Now..... if I run any games in dx9 or dx9 mode, I can keep that wonderfully high resolution and let me tell you.... life is good. However, and this is where the MS part is injected into the story, I (nor anyone else) can run that resolution in dx10 mode. At least I'm under the impression that MS has more control over DirectX than anyone else. We're limited to a notch or 2 lower in resolution. My impression via widescreengamingforums.com is that there's a lot of lack of communication between MS, Nvidia and Matrox in making this work. Many people have found workarounds in the form of custom resolutions in later driver releases, but it's still a hit or miss situation.
HOWEVER! I tried the public RC release of Win7 and after some icky moments, I managed to get 7 working with a 180.xx driver set (one of the older ones) and somehow got a custom rez of 5040x1050. +1 for 7, because Vista just could not and would not do that. Granted that it's a RC, but I lost Aero effects when I got the resolution switched over. If I changed drivers to a more current version, I'd lose what I had. That alone is making me switch over to 7. The RC is very, very smooth, stable and cool.
I realize that I and the WSGF.com's crew are a minority in this situation, but it's a very legit situation as the amount of hardware used to pull this kind of stunt off can cut into the wallet pretty deep and it seems Matrox has pretty constant contact with a few of the key members. $300ish for the Triplehead2Go digital box and then the cost of 3 lcd's that can run 1680x1050 @57hz. It's all very specific, but worth it in the end. There is nothing like running TF2, HAWX or Crysis in a surround gaming setup and many, many people would love to see support extended to and maybe even enhanced in Win7. (I totally ran it all at the last Fites150 and got quite a few compliments. Then my jerk friend Fred got HIS picture taken with his xbox running on 3 screens. 8))
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Finally got VXP working on a system (sort of). Impressions so far are that performance of the VM sucks! I'm posting this from an Opera install that's running in VXP mode. I had a lot of problems getting it to work though, so maybe something didn't install quite right. I'll have to play around with this later. Time to go home.
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[rant]
Windows7 would be irrelevant to me if steam would release a Linux client. I think this is holding back the majority of power users/gamers from giving a damn about Microsoft. Think of the resources that would be freed from removing Areo and all the applications that are needed to keep windows from imploding (Spy ware removal/anti-virus/firewall/etc
[/rant]
I'm waiting till an activator comes out so I don't have to deal with Microsoft's drones ever again. As an actual paying customer (I own real copies of Vista and XP64) I have been hassled by WGA. I cracked my own purchased copies and have never had to deal with calling in and talking to people or downloading authentication apps on a cracked version.
I skipped Vista because it seemed like a royal PITA, but 7 looks good enough for me to run.
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Hey Zx pm me I might have something for you. And on another note Win7 for me is giving my USB issues. It won't detect any of my flash drives or my enclosure. I got to work once, but it was dog slow coming up.
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Hey Zx pm me I might have something for you. And on another note Win7 for me is giving my USB issues. It won't detect any of my flash drives or my enclosure. I got to work once, but it was dog slow coming up.
Yeah, I am having Win 7 USB issues... Like it kinda goes limp after it starts copying... Or like in the middle of an iPod sync...
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Yeah, I am having Win 7 USB issues... Like it kinda goes limp after it starts copying... Or like in the middle of an iPod sync...
Lucky you I can't even get to recognize let alone copy anything. I went into Device Manager and saw a USB harddrive I turned on was in the list. Thing is it would never load it. Try to uninstall it from Device Manager but it just hangs. Really making me mad.
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The only USB issue I had with Win7(x64) was after it came out of sleep. Sometimes USB hardware wouldn't be recognized correctly....such as my Xbox 360 wireless controller thing. All was well after a quick reboot though.
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Yeah, I have no issue with any USB HIDs... It's only storage devices. Mice, Keyboard, Controller do-dads, sound devices all work fine.