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LAN Party Forums => FITES Feedback => Started by: _!Rathe!_ on March 04, 2009, 10:55:19 AM
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**Continuation from the feedback thread**
I would say domination or sabotage for a game type instead of search and destroy. Something with multiple respawns per round rather than 1 life per round. Also with domination or search and destroy you cancel out the defending or attacking advantage the one team has.
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I vote for domination and ditch that damn mod bs. Go Pub style and announce it WAY before hand.
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Or have two tourneys, one for pub style and one for DAMN mod or CAL style.
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Or have two tourneys, one for pub style and one for DAMN mod or CAL style.
I would be up for that.
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With what time?
EDIT:
Also, how are you going to ready up? You know to make the match live? That's also what the mod does. What about alternatives to being a JUST pub server?
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Or have two tourneys, one for pub style and one for DAMN mod or CAL style.
Was just about to suggest this haha
Sabotage is really fun to play, it didn't really catch on when CAL had a league for it though. It's traditionally been s&d throughout CoD league play and people don't want to shift away from it, but I'd be up for sabotage as well
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Mohalla, did I see you on the [NT] TF2 server last night, stabbing me from behind at the spy?
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With what time?
EDIT:
Also, how are you going to ready up? You know to make the match live? That's also what the mod does. What about alternatives to being a JUST pub server?
I would go for a Damn mod sabotage or domination map style. Or we find a mod that can unlock all weapons and add the ready up feature. Like this one: http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863 (http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863)
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Mohalla, did I see you on the [NT] TF2 server last night, stabbing me from behind at the spy?
Sure did :)
Blame Petch, I joined off him
I would go for a Damn mod sabotage or domination map style. Or we find a mod that can unlock all weapons and add the ready up feature. Like this one: [url]http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863[/url] ([url]http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863[/url])
The only trouble with this is that people tend to gravitate toward the same guns. In the few weeks before mods came out people would unlock the p90 and steady aim and use nothing else during scrims. The reason there is a class limitation on SMGs is that people would all take SMGs, rush, and never lose a round. The same thing would happen with the Barrett, as dumb as it sounds teams would rush, use scroll wheel to fire full auto, get a lucky shot off and kill the other team. Like I said in the other thread, all it does is remove the skill gap between better and worse players in competition.
Again though, some people obviously would rather play the game the way they are familiar with it. Two tourneys would solve this, and I think TWL uses a version of PAM or DAMN that is closer to pub play but still restricts a couple things and fixes some of the bugs if having 2 tournaments isn't an option.
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With what time?
EDIT:
Also, how are you going to ready up? You know to make the match live? That's also what the mod does. What about alternatives to being a JUST pub server?
I would go for a Damn mod sabotage or domination map style. Or we find a mod that can unlock all weapons and add the ready up feature. Like this one: [url]http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863[/url] ([url]http://www.modcod4.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?863[/url])
The mod you listed is basically a pub server mod w/ ready up...
I think Mohalla is bringing up good points with mods/retail play like this removing the skill gap, all mods like this are doing unlocking everything, and let the best random shot get the win. I don't see where this is coming into play when your in a competition and trying to prove who the best players are.
I do understand that you guys are upset that some of your favorite weapons/perks were removed, but are they really the only weapons/perks you can use? We all know that quite a few combinations are cheap and garbage, we even ask people to not use certain things during our small LANs.
I don't object to using another mod at all, but it should be something that is based around keeping fair competitive play, showing who has the best shot, not who has the best random shot.
Also, I don't believe having two tournament setups for this game is even close to being feasible (due to time restraints). If your only worried about your K:D ratio then take it to a pub or open play server, but if your wanting to see who the best players/teams are, then sign up for the tournament and have a fair competition.
EDIT: Also as Mohalla mentions, we can modify the current configs using PAM/DAMN/ProMod to hopefully satisfy all, but again modifications should be picked with keeping competitive play in mind, not pub action.
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With what time?
EDIT:
Also, how are you going to ready up? You know to make the match live? That's also what the mod does. What about alternatives to being a JUST pub server?
Like I said before, I could care less, it was just a suggestion.
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The mod you listed is basically a pub server mod w/ ready up...
I think Mohalla is bringing up good points with mods/retail play like this removing the skill gap, all mods like this are doing unlocking everything, and let the best random shot get the win. I don't see where this is coming into play when your in a competition and trying to prove who the best players are.
I do understand that you guys are upset that some of your favorite weapons/perks were removed, but are they really the only weapons/perks you can use? We all know that quite a few combinations are cheap and garbage, we even ask people to not use certain things during our small LANs.
I don't object to using another mod at all, but it should be something that is based around keeping fair competitive play, showing who has the best shot, not who has the best random shot.
Also, I don't believe having two tournament setups for this game is even close to being feasible. If your only worried about your K:D ratio then take it to a pub or open play server, but if your wanting to see who the best players/teams are, then sign up for the tournament and have a fair competition.
EDIT: Also as Mohalla mentions, we can modify the current configs using PAM/DAMN/ProMod to hopefully satisfy all, but again modifications should be picked with keeping competitive play in mind, not pub action.
Having all the guns and perks available in the game doesn't make it a random chance of killing someone. There is still a large amount of skill and part of that skill is creating an effective package for your gaming style. I agree there are some cheap combos and tactics (mouse wheel fire bind) and those need to be addressed in the rules. As much as I rail against F3ar0n for his hacked silenced skorpion, I know it isn't just shoot somewhere in the vicinity of the opposing player and he dies, because I have used the weapon myself.
If the game itself wasn't fair and competitive it wouldn't be played online to the degree it is. I have come across some games where there is one or two overpowered classes or cars and no one uses anything else, and the online play suffered from it because there was no variety.
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TWL's comp mod has many more unlocks and takes out only the REALLY dumb stuff last I saw, they may even still be using PAM. But yea sabotage is still my favorite non-sd gametype
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I know it isn't just shoot somewhere in the vicinity of the opposing player and he dies, because I have used the weapon myself.
Well, that's just the problem with all the perks/guns unlocked. Steady aim p90s ruled the day during early scrims because they could take out anyone in 2-3 hits even at a decent distance, and all you do need to do for that to be effective is shoot into the other player's vicinity. Autosnipers could be used to pick people by just clicking a lot near them rather than aiming for chest/head, and deep impact RPDs destroyed people who were behind cover by just holding in the trigger and guessing.
Believe me, this was a hot debate for months while leagues tried to get a ruleset nailed down. They tried out tons of different mods/rules and all that testing has gone into making the more recent mods, DAMN included. The class and gun restrictions are all there to prevent bad teams from outrandoming better ones.
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I'd have to say 2 tourneys. One DAMN mod Search and Destroy. It forces you to have better skill and better teamwork to come out on top and in my opinion is way better than Counterstrike Source. The second could be pub style Domination but set rules for no Martyerdome etc.
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If the game itself wasn't fair and competitive it wouldn't be played online to the degree it is. I have come across some games where there is one or two overpowered classes or cars and no one uses anything else, and the online play suffered from it because there was no variety.
The reason COD4 gets played so much online in pubs isn't because it's fare and balanced...by far. It gets played so much because there are perks and weapons that make it easy for the worst of players to get kills and be able to compete against the best players.
I have to agree with Petch that in competitive play you need a mod to balance everything out so you're playing with skill and not perks. And I see DAMN mod for COD4 or the new Modern Warfare 2 taking over Counterstrike Source's place. It's by far a better and more competetive game. Which I I wouldn't be suprised to see CSS touney's fade away and seeing more COD4 or COD4-2 tourney's popping up.
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I'll contribute my two cents here.
CoD4 is designed around the perks option. The allure to the game is to custom create a player to your specs and your style of gameplay. There's a lot of talk on this thread about "lucky shots". There will ALWAYS be lucky shots. No matter what game people will always get a lucky shot. If you don't think so pull out that auto shotgun in CSS and see how many people you piss off.
There's a lot of talk about SMGs taking out snipers. Well, if you are a sniper out in the open and not watching your angles, you deserve to get shot by an SMG.
There will be players who use the perks to help their game because they suck otherwise. (Juggernaut, Last Stand, Martyrdom, insert your hated perk of choice.) Then there will be players who use perks in a set way to enhance that class, i.e. creating a special stealth or sniper class that has perks designed around the way you play that class.
All in all, I think the idea of removing perks and weapon options is removing the essence of the game. If people want to play the game in a tourney style then they should play the game the way it was meant to be. With weapon and perk options. I don't think anyone can argue that the DAM mod made CoD4 a pretty version of CSS. If you want to play that, go ahead, but I think people are doing a huge injustice to the game, and insulting the original developers of the game by limiting the options the player has.
As for game type, I'm all for Domination or Sabotage. It makes for exciting game play that lasts right up to the end, and can be played quicker considering it is just one round.
I also see the problem of having both a DAM mod game, and an "Everybody at level 55" pub game. Where is the time in the weekend, and where are the available staff to monitor the tourney. Valid points, but I have confidence in the FITES staff to come up with a good decision.
Will their decision keep me from attending a LAN? No, but I'm an easy going gamer. Others out there will get sand all up in their ass crack and run away like crying two year olds. Ultimately I feel that gamers should play and respect the game for what it is, and not place limitations on other players in the name of "skill" or "level playing field". Don't you think the perks were placed there to make a level field for all gamers to begin with?